'58 Edsel's 361 (303 HP) Factory Claim Vs. Real Dyno Results

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Shelby#18
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'58 Edsel's 361 (303 HP) Factory Claim Vs. Real Dyno Results

Post by Shelby#18 » Mon 26. Jul 2010, 14:39

A big thanks to Dane LaFortune (My restorer) for finding this, and scanning for us. I have the next issue on order for Chapter 2, and will post when received.
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Re: 1958 MEL 361 Horsepower article

Post by Shelby#18 » Thu 29. Jul 2010, 15:53

As promised the conclusion of the article.
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Re: 1958 MEL 361 Horsepower article

Post by KULTULZ » Mon 2. Aug 2010, 02:05

You realize the 361 (1958-1959) was an EDSEL specific (E-400) FE? It was a 390 bore size with a 352 stroke (same as later 360 FE light truck engine.

Interesting article though.

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Re: 1958 MEL 361 Horsepower article

Post by Theo » Mon 2. Aug 2010, 03:30

That's right. I didn't realize it too because I had no time yet to take a look at it. Viewing the pics the cylinder head chambers are typical FE chambers. It looks like a very interesting article though. I'd love to read it when time allows within the next few days. Rick, I'd vote for renaming the topic and keeping it in the MEL forum though.
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Re: 1958 361 Horsepower. Edsels Love Affair with the FE engi

Post by Shelby#18 » Mon 2. Aug 2010, 10:29

The reason for the post was so that others could see the Hp results not being what was stated from the factory literature. (And I'm fine with the title change.)

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Re: 1958 Edsel's 361 HP Factory Literature Vs. Real Dyno Re

Post by Theo » Mon 2. Aug 2010, 10:50

Rick, I changed the topic title to "1958 Edsel's 361 HP Factory Literature Vs. Real Dyno Resuls" if you don't mind. Just change it if you feel you have s.th. more adequate to the topic. I'm only suggesting.
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Re: '58 Edsel's 361 (303 HP) Factory Claim Vs. Real Dyno Res

Post by Theo » Mon 2. Aug 2010, 17:59

That's much better. Thanx for correcting.
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Re: '58 Edsel's 361 (303 HP) Factory Claim Vs. Real Dyno Res

Post by KULTULZ » Mon 2. Aug 2010, 22:53

This now gets one wondering as to whether the first release 58 352 (solid lifters-machined combustion chambers) did meet factory HP ratings and this engine (361) and the later modified 352 (hydraulic lifters) were actually detuned to meet the racing ban of the period and the factory did not change the claimed HP ratings.

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Re: '58 Edsel's 361 (303 HP) Factory Claim Vs. Real Dyno Res

Post by a58pacer » Sun 26. Sep 2010, 21:04

The E400 could not have been derived from a detuned or derated 352cid (solid-lifters-machined combustion chambers) because it was sold nearly two months before 1958 Ford's introduction (Sep 4, 1957). If anything, it would have been the other way around. Although the E400 had hydraulic lifters, the earlier version (until sometime in early calendar year 1958) also had the machined combustion chambers.

It is believed the transition to as-cast chambers, along with some compensating dimensional changes to the head-to-block surfacing process, contributed to the drop in compression ratio (from 10.5:1 down to 9.6:1) of the 1959 Edsel Super-Express V-8, which was also a four-barrel carburetor 361cid FE-block engine, versus the earlier E400. There was also a torque derating noted in the published specs: while E400 delivered 400 ft.-lbs. @ 2900 RPM, the Super Express V-8 would reach only 390 ft.-lbs. @ 2800 RPM.

It is estimated by some serious students of the Edsel that perhaps 85 percent, or more, of 1958 Edsel E400 production used machined combustion chambers. This is due to the fact that 83.5 per-cent of junior series 1958 Edsel production (E400, all of them) was scheduled between July 15 and December 31, 1957.

While it is believed the combustion chamber transition may have been related to the dissolution of the Edsel Division and the resultant formation of the MEL division, no firm change-over dates have been established to date through FoMoCo documentation, to my knowledge. Many of us continue to search for more accurate information regarding this fairly significant, but hard-to-detect in the field, production change.

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Re: '58 Edsel's 361 (303 HP) Factory Claim Vs. Real Dyno Res

Post by KULTULZ » Mon 27. Sep 2010, 05:47

a58pacer wrote:
While it is believed the combustion chamber transition may have been related to the dissolution of the Edsel Division and the resultant formation of the MEL division, no firm change-over dates have been established to date through FoMoCo documentation, to my knowledge. Many of us continue to search for more accurate information regarding this fairly significant, but hard-to-detect in the field, production change.
The cyl head and camshaft was detuned so as for FORD to comply with the 1958 ban on factory sponsored racing. The cyl heads went from machined to cast chambers as a result of cost (even though they were re-introduced on the 1960 352CI 360HP engine). I believe the tappets were changed as a result of customer complaint of excessive engine noise.

One would need MPC's and TSB's (FORD-EDSEL) of that period to begin to fully realize the facts. I have always found old EDSEL tech info to be very expensive.

For instance, the TBIRD only received the hydraulic 352. The solid 352 was discontinued very early in the production year.

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